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Arlene (17 Feb 2012)
"For F.M. Riley....a sincere answer..."


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Dear F.M.Riley....You asked where America was referred to in the bible as "Babylon". I think you'll find that if you read Jeremiah 50:12. Yes, it talks about Chaldea, but verse 14 makes it clear that Babylon will be destroyed in the time of the end. The bible doesn't call nations by their present names because the names have been changed. Persia is now Iran, Istanbul was Constantinople (I remember that from a song in my youth). You asked for an answer to a sincere question:

http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/feb2012/fmriley216-2.htm

Doesn't America have a "mother"? I have often heard England referred to as "Mother England" in history references. And isn't America the "hindermost" of the nations? That means the last nation to become a major world power....that's us!!! So, when I read Jeremiah 50:12....immediately I thought of America.

The Statue of Liberty sitting in t! he Harbor of NYC is said to be the statue of "Isis" or "Aphrodite", or one of the many names of the goddesses of the mythologies. This reminds me of Revelation 17:4 of the woman with the "golden cup in her hand". The Statue of Liberty has 7 spikes in her crown. They stand for the 7 continents of the world....and that reminds me of Rev. 17:9 and the "seven mountains" on which the woman sits. America has military bases on just about every continent in the world as well as being the home of the United Nations. We are a multicultural nation, which reminds me of verse 15. And lastly, just in chapter 17, verse 18 is the clincher..."And the woman which thou sawest is that great city (NYC), which reigneth over the kings of the earth (U.N)."

I can't see any other nation or city on earth which fits this description of "Mystery" Babylon. Perhaps that's why God uses the word mystery because He wants us to solve the problem. Proverb! s 25:2..."It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter." So, if America isn't end-time Babylon, I can't really see any other nation or city that would fit the description. Rome certainly doesn't! And neither does present day Babylon which was rebuilt by Saddam Hussein...but it's not a great center of commerce that sits on "many waters". America sits on whole lots of waters....Atlantic, Pacific, Gulf of Mexico, Great Lakes, etc...many more. (Sorry, geography is not my best subject), but you get the picture.

This is my sincere answer to your question. There is a great book on this by R.A. Coombs called "America, The Babylon"....I've seen it for sale on the internet as a cd-ROM. However, I don't know computers well enough to buy it...but I've read some parts of it, and he says the same things I've researched and found out. I hope this answers adequately...

Sincer! ely, YSIC,

Arlene



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Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.


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Our New Website URL
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For Fair Use Discussion and Educational Purposes

http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/feb2012/barrya217.htm

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Barry Amundsen (17 Feb 2012)
"F.M. Riley, "A sincere question""

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FM Riley,



http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/feb2012/fmriley216-2.htm



Firstly, using your argument against the USA being the fulfillment of Babylon in the last days because the name America is not mentioned by name in scripture one could also then argue that the Name Jesus is not found in the Old Testament and therefore He is not the target of prophecies found there either.



There is a historic city of Babylon with walls and boundaries of stone or physical borders but there is also a belief system which though it may have had its origins in this same geographic location under a man named Nimrod (meaning “let us rebel” who is described as a mighty hunter before or “against” the Lord), since ancient times it has spread out to cover the earth. They originally planned and began to build a tower that would reach to heaven as an assault on and in an attempt to fight against the anointed One of God and take His throne by force (please see Psalm 2). God interrupted their plan by confusing the builders’ languages but has not completely destroyed their outfit and has prophesied that though Messiah (Jesus) would come and deliver a major blow to this kingdom at His first coming, He would not break off or snuff out the bruised reed or the smoking flax until He comes again at the last days and finishes it off for good then. Daniel gives insights into all of this.



Meanwhile this system remains in the earth for centuries and has never ceased its original purpose and plan to throw off the Kingdom of God for its own freedom or “liberty” from that true Kingdom as Psalm 2 says, as it describes an as yet future showdown. It has mostly operated in secret and therefore is referred to as "Mystery Babylon the Great, Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth" etc. This system has never been confined to one geographical location but fills the whole earth as Daniel said it would, though it would rule the earth from a geographical location which is prophesied to be destroyed in one hour.



Jesus was demonstrating His complete separateness from this very system of religion when He proclaimed that unlike this secret system He did nothing in secret but all His teaching was done openly in public streets and what He taught was verifiable by interviewing anyone who was there to listen to Him. Jesus said this other kingdom was of this world and of their father the devil while His kingdom was not of this world. He also distanced Himself and His kingdom from this one when He said that His kingdom did not come with great show and fanfare but comes inside of a person, unlike the Mystery Babylon way, which is all about great show and fanfare (Super Bowl, Olympics, et al). In spite of their secret meanings in the symbolism, they still do very public displays. They have a term for that which is given as meanings of what is displayed for the masses "exoteric" and one for that which is kept only for the insiders "esoteric" to whom they wish to reveal the double or secret meanings of the same things which are seen but not understood by the public.



The Bible is very clear that the Babylon of the latter days is not merely a geographically locatable place but much more is a secret society and belief system from of old. One has only to look at the treatment in scripture of the city of Jerusalem being called by its spiritually significant name to understand this basic principle of spiritual realities in the unseen world. But this requires maturity and paradoxically childlike humility that is sadly lacking in would-be experts who see only in the natural or “sensually” (using only the 5 senses for understanding – not letting the Holy Spirit instruct) as brute beasts which deny the spirit. Of whom we have been warned that in the latter days they should come and against whom we have been commissioned to “earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints (Jude). According to Jesus we are either gathering into His kingdom or else we are scattering abroad.



Was Jesus crucified in either Sodom or Egypt? Yes, He was according to the inspired book of Revelation 11:



8. And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.



This principle is clear for those who see it.



The descriptions of Babylon in the latter days as outlined in scripture are sufficient enough to suggest that there is neither time nor perceived movement currently unfolding for the ancient location city of Babylon to fulfill any of the required elements to be the city that is described in prophecy for the last days.



Yet by stark contrast to this vastly rich, prosperous port city in the latter days which remains yet to be destroyed we also have this description of the ancient city of Babylon which was destroyed never to be rebuilt:



Isaiah 13:

17. Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, which shall not regard silver; and as for gold, they shall not delight in it.

18. Their bows also shall dash the young men to pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eye shall not spare children.

19. And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees' excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah.

20. It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation: neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there.

21. But wild beasts of the desert shall lie there; and their houses shall be full of doleful creatures; and owls shall dwell there, and Satyrs shall dance there.

22. And the wild beasts of the islands shall cry in their desolate houses, and dragons in their pleasant palaces: and her time is near to come, and her days shall not be prolonged.



The Medes did indeed fulfill these prophecies and after them Alexander the Great also took part. This ancient city remains to this day in ruins and the locals will not remain there after dark due to the terrifying spirits that still haunt that location. The King James translators took exception to the actual descriptions of these creatures because of the prevalent belief of their day that evil spirits did not exist and therefore used some animal names in place of the actual evil spirits that were in reference. But this location is filled with evil spirits still today just as prophesied. Husain attempted to rebuild this city back in 1987 and thought of himself as Nebuchadnezzar reincarnated but we all know what became of that. According to the above scripture this location is NEVER to be rebuilt.



F. M. Riley, in spite of the above scripture stating clearly that this ancient site will never be inhabited, is it your position that someone must rebuild this ancient city at this geographic location in order for it to become a hub of world trade and location of world rulership before any of the prophecies foretelling its demise can take place? If so, how can you be looking for a soon fulfillment of any end-times prophecy, seeing that there are none of the elements taking place there in that old location? I have also heard Chuck Missler tell a national radio audience while on Coast To Coast AM to be watching this ancient city location for signs of being rebuilt and become the center of world trade and rule. I find this utterly amazing when the evidence for the fulfillment in spiritual and literal terms is going on so blatantly in the world for those with eyes to see it.



Hold fast what you have that no man take your crown.



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum, ( http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com ) does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com

I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic

Steven


Our New Website URL
http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com