Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum

(Rapture is a Vatican/Jesuit Lie )
The "Resurrection" has been erroneously labeled The "Rapture". 
THERE IS NO RAPTURE

WHY THE TITLE RAPTURE BIBLE PROPHECY FORUM?
WE STARTED OUT BELIEVING IN A 7 YR PRE TRIBULATION RAPTURE
BUT FOUND OVER TIME AROUND 2006 THAT THE BIBLE DOES NOT SHARE A 
BIBLE VERSE WHATSOEVER INDICATING A 7 YR PRE TRIBULATION RAPTURE

BIBLE VERSES EVIDENCE:

While Yahusha/JESUS was alive, He prayed to His Father: "I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.  John 17:15 (KJV)

Yahusha/JESUS gave signs of what must happen before His Return:  "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:"  Matt. 24:29 (KJV)


WE DAILY STUDY TO SHEW OURSELVES APPROVED 
WE ARE NOT AFRAID TO SAY WE ARE LEARNING DAILY AND 
ARE ABLE TO ADMIT WE MAKE MISTAKES BUT STUDY TO 
LEARN EVERY DAY.

LET YHVH/YAHUSHA BE TRUE 
AND EVERY MAN A LIAR.

To Join and post on this site e-mail for a password
​​​​​​​stevensandiego@ymail.com

WEBSITE: HTTP://WWW.RAPTUREBIBLEPROPHECYFORUM.COM

FACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Rapture-Bible-Prophecy-Forum/362856490414697

Hebrew 5782-5788   Gregorian 2022-2028

THIS SITE IS ABOUT Yahusha/JESUS
 
We are followers of Yahusha/JESUS Only​​​​​​​
Yahusha/
JESUS IS GOD/YHVH
Yahusha/
JESUS is YHVH/GOD/YHWH-Yahusha/Son:
​​​​​​​Yahusha/
JESUS is The WORD

Yahusha is I Am That I Am  (Exodus 3:14)

Yahusha is YHWH  come in the flesh, He put aside His Diety to become a human, born of  a Virgin.

Yahusha is the Word, As The Most High, He spoke all things seen and unseen into existence

When YHWH created Light, He was revealed to the angels. 

John 14:26
"the breath of life"

But the Comforter, which is "the breath of life", whom the Father will send shall teach you all things.

God is not His  Name but a term.  The Holy Spirit is not a person but the very Breath of the Father.

There is no Trinity.  The Father, YHVH  and Yahusha are One  (John 10:30)

THE BOOK OF ENOCH

NOW IS THE TIME!

 FOR A REMOTE GENERATION THE LAST GENERATION FOR THE ELECT!

Book of Enoch: http://tinyurl.com/BkOfEnoch

The book of Second Peter and Jude Authenticate the book of Enoch and Vice Versa

Yahusha/JESUS QUOTED FROM THE SEPTUAGINT:

THE APOSTLES QUOTED FROM THE SEPTUAGINT

JEWS WERE CONVERTING TO CHRISTIANITY

FREE DOWNLOADS

All Of The Apocryphal Books Of

The King James 1611 Version

http://www.scriptural-truth.com/apocrypha_books.html 

Pray for one another, as we watch for the Lord's  return!


Bible Prophecy Forum Postings
Start a New Topic 
Author
Comment
A.A. and Twelve Steps demonically inspired

For Fair Use Discussion and Educational Purposes

http://www.raptureready.com/soap/lanagan7.html

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

A.A. and Twelve Steps demonically inspired

John Lanagan



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Do not turn to mediums or spiritists; do not seek them out to be defiled by them. I am the Lord your God. (Leviticus 19:31)

This blog, My Word Like Fire, was created to correct claims that A.A. and the Twelve Steps are, or ever were, Christian in origin. It is an important issue since many Christians enter Alcoholics Anonymous because they have been assured the co-founders were Christians.

According to A.A. co-founder Bill Wilson himself, "In some ways I feel very close to conservative Christianity. In other respects--important ones to Christians--no particular convictions seem to come. Maybe down deep I don't want to be convinced. I just don't know." 1

Bill Wilson wasn’t a Christian. But Bill had the ability to compartmentalize his beliefs, to the point of being able to sincerely espouse (when necessary) what needed to be heard, or said, or read.

We see this in Bill's flirtatious period with Catholicism. According to his official A.A. biography, "Because he was able to see so many facets of any given issue, conflicting as well as harmonious, he may have spoken one day as if he was intending to convert, and the next as though his religious instruction was undertaken only in the service of his spiritual growth. It is probable that despite the contradictory thoughts being expressed, he was entirely sincere in what he said each time. He didn't change his mind easily, particularly on so serious an issue; rather, he saw things differently on different occasions. That may have been bewildering for those around him, but it appeared to make total sense to him." 2

Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. "You will know them by their fruits. Grapse are not gathered from thorn bushes, nor figs from thistles, are they?" (Matthew 7:15-16)

Although Bill rejected the Virgin Birth 3, and experimented with LSD for ego-reduction to allow the "influx of God's grace," 4 this has not deterred pro-AA author Dick B. and others from claiming Bill was a Christian. And the stakes are high over this erroneous assertion. Until we understand where the Twelve Steps came from, and the spirituality of both Bill Wilson and Dr. Bob Smith, nothing will change.

Francis Hartigan was the secretary for Lois Wilson, Bill’s wife, for thirteen years. He had many conversations with Lois about Bill. He writes, “[A.A. co-founder Bill Wilson's] belief in God might have become unshakeable, but he could never embrace any theology or even the divinity of Jesus, and he went to his grave unable to give his own personal idea of God much definition. In this sense, he was never very far removed from the unbelievers.” 5

What did Wilson worship? His higher power may well have been, ultimately, spiritualism itself.

AA historian Ernest Kurtz notes, “So profound was Bill’s immersion in this area [spiritualism] that he at times confused the terms ‘spiritualism’ and ‘spirituality.’” 6

Writer Matthew J. Raphael, who is an A.A. member himself, observes, “it might be said for the cofounders at least, A.A. was entangled with spiritualism from the very beginning.” 7

Raphael explains, “Wilson himself seems to have been an ‘adept,’ that is, ‘gifted’ in the psychic sense; and he served as a medium for a variety of ‘controls,’ some of them recurrent. ‘Controls,’ in the lingo of spiritualism, are the discarnate entities who seem to usurp a medium’s identity and literally speak through him or (far more usually) her. Sometimes a control answers questions; sometimes a spirit seems to materialize.” 8

According to the official A.A. biography of Bill Wilson, "Because Bill was such a sensitive person in this world, it should come as no surprise that he believed himself able to pick up energy from another. He thought of himself as having some psychic ability; to him, spiritistic matters were no mere parlor game. It's not clear when he first became interested in extrasensory phenomena; the field was something that [AA co-founder Dr. Bob Smith and his wife, Anne] were also deeply involved with. Whether or not Bill became initially interested through them, there are references to seances and other psychic events in the letters Bill wrote to Lois during that first Akron summer with the Smiths, in 1935." 9

Wilson's demonic interactions via spiritualism served as a major factor in both origin and development of A.A. and the Twelve Steps, as did the anti-biblical meditation learned via the Oxford Group (READ). In terms of communication with the spirit world, movies and television shows and nationally renowned psychics do not change what the Lord declares. If you are a Christian, perhaps you can take time to consider this. A holy God does not want us participating in--or amusing ourselves with--these things He hates.

As for the person who turns to mediums and and to spiritists, to play the harlot after them, I will also set My face against that person and cut him off from among his people. You shall consecrate yourselves therefore and be holy, for I am the Lord your God. (Leviticus 20:6-7)

In many ways, Alcoholics Anonymous serves as a decoy. Relatively few come to Christ there, but Christians are given the impression that this is a frequent thing. The Twelve Steps were given to Bill Wilson for the purpose of keeping unbelievers from Christ, and for watering down the beliefs of those who do know Him. In these terms, Alcoholics Anonymous has been an astounding success. In The Fall of the Evangelical Nation, author Christine Wicker credits Alcoholics Anonymous with “hastening the fall of the evangelical church.” The author notes how A.A. ”slowly exposed people to the notion they could get [a god] without the dogma, the doctrine, and the outdated rules. Without the church, in fact.” [10]

In other words, people could worship whatever form of “god” they imagine. The A.A. deity, the “higher power,” is a lot like a salad bar-people choose a little of this, a little of that. What is on the plate can always be added to, subtracted, or rearranged. But when “god” is so malleable, so is morality.

Since the Twelve Steps have nothing to do with Christ, neither sin nor Biblical repentance is addressed. This, of course, is very appealing to the flesh. The Steps address “wrongs,” “making amends,” and “moral inventory,” but one inserts one's own moral code within the context of these Steps.

A.A. often serves to instill fear and/or contempt for alternative sobriety methods. This certainly includes Christianity. Could our churches do more for addicts? Yes. Yet, help is available within the the Body of Christ. Christ will make a way. Pastors give lip service to this, but don't necessarily believe it--which is why we have a demonically inspired Twelve Step system in the heart of the church today. If we look at 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, we see alcoholics, homosexuals, and other sinners repenting and serving Christ. This is a key passage for those who struggle.

Now, about those addicts, some in suits, and others on the street: Their bondage may be foreign to you, and it is a weird, weird thing, but please, have compassion. Will you, and your church fellowship, serve them as Christ served others? This does not mean telling them about Celebrate Recovery or the local A.A. meeting. I have to say, many who have effectively ministered to me have never been addicted, never been on the street, never had a needle in their arm. The Holy Spirit will use those He chooses--we perhaps have not been all that cooperative in this.

According to the Alcoholics Anonymous Big Book (the A.A. “bible”), “We found that God does not make too hard terms with those who seek Him. To us, the Realm of the Spirit is broad, roomy, all inclusive; never exclusive or forbidding to those who earnestly seek. It is open, we believe, to all men. When, therefore, we speak to you of God, we mean your own conception of God.” [11] (Bold mine)

“Broad, roomy, all inclusive” spirituality, this is what the Alcoholics Anonymous textbook teaches.

But not Jesus. The Lord specifically warns against the broad way. “Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is BROAD that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.” (Matthew 7:13)

If the Lord warns against the broad way of spirituality, why do we think we know better? Why would we even want to participate in such a thing, or give it credibility by approving of it?

The A.A. Big Book again makes a direct reference to this spiritual Broad Highway: “If our testimony helps sweep away prejudice, enables you to think honestly, encourages you to search diligently within yourself, then, if you wish, you can join us on the Broad Highway. With this attitude you cannot fail. The consciousness of your belief is sure to come to you.” [12] (Bold mine)

If you struggle, please realize that A.A. is by no means the only path to sobriety. Don't let the A.A. folks convince you otherwise.

If you are an addict, please consider eternity. Through Jesus you can live forever. Reject Him, and your worst day as a drunk or heroin addict cannot compare to the pain of hell. I am not trying to scare you. Christ saved me, and I pray He saves you. My friend, all this stuff about a "higher power" is a lie. I tell you this not to make you angry, but so that you may be spared.

...and how you turned to God from idols to serve a living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, that is Jesus, who rescues us from the wrath to come. (1 Thessalonians 1:9-10)

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me." (John 14:6)

Simply tell God you recognize that you are a sinner who cannot save yourself. Ask forgiveness for your sins, and tell the Lord you now place your trust in Christ alone to be your Lord and your Savior.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Ephesians 2:8-9)

Pray with me: Lord, I have sinned against you, and I cannot save myself. Please forgive my sins. Jesus, I believe you died and rose three days later, that you atoned for my sins, and I trust you as my Lord and Savior. I will follow and obey you, Lord. Thank you for saving me. Amen.

Surely the God who can grant eternal life can grant His child sobriety, amen?

Endnotes:

1. June 2, 1959 letter from Bill Wilson to Father Ed Dowling. This letterquoted fromby Robert Fitzgerald, S.J., in his book, The Soul of Sponsorship, pg. 92

2. PASS IT ON, pg. 282

3. Robert Fitzgerald, S.J., The Soul of Sponsorship, pg. 51

4. PASS IT ON, pg. 370-371

5. Frances Hartigan, Bill W., pg. 123

6. Ernest Kurtz, Not-God, pg. 136

7. Matthew J. Raphael, Bill W. and Mr. Wilson, pg. 159

8. Ibid., pg. 159

9. PASS IT ON, pg. 275

10. Christine Wicker, The Fall of the Evangelical Nation, pg. 134-138

11. ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS ("Big Book"), pg. 46-47

12. Ibid., pg. 55

What? You want more detail aboutBill Wilson and spirits? Are you sure? It's creepy, but go ahead and READthis...

For more information on Alcoholics Anonymous:

http://mywordlikefire.wordpress.com




++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Forum, does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com

I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic

Steven

Re: A.A. and Twelve Steps demonically inspired

For Fair Use Discussion and Educational Purposes

http://www.raptureready.com/resource/hunt/dh2.html

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



God as You Conceive Him/Her/It


The devastation wrought by Alcoholics Anonymous (A.A.), founded in 1935, and the spread of its 12 Steps has been enormous. One can scarcely keep track of the many 12-step groups A.A. has spawned: Adult Children of Alcoholics, Debtors Anonymous, Emotions Anonymous, Gamblers Anonymous, Sex Addicts Anonymous, Shoplifters Anonymous (to name a few)-and even Fundamentalists Anonymous for "recovery" from fundamentalism. In a book that every Christian ought to read, 12 Steps to Destruction (see book list), Martin and Deidre Bobgan point out, "Thousands of groups across America. ..and most codependency/recovery programs utilize the Twelve Steps in one way or another...."

New Age psychiatrist M. Scott Peck (a pseudo-Christian endorsed by many church leaders) has called the founding of Alcoholics Anonymous "the greatest event of the twentieth century."(1) Christianity Today says, "The 12-Step movement has tapped a profound need in people.(2) Bestselling Christian author Keith Miller calls the 12-Step Program "a way of spiritual healing and growth that may well be the most important spiritual model of any age for many contemporary Christians."(3)

In fact, the 12 Steps of A.A. came by direct inspiration from the demonic world and they open the door to the occult by introducing members to a false god. Step 2 says, "Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity." Step 3 continues, "Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to God as we [Hindu, Buddhist, Christian, Mormon, shaman, agnostic, et al.] understood Him." In Christianity Today, Tim Stafford says, "The 12 Steps are Christian."(4) Yet they contain no mention of Jesus Christ, much less of the gospel. In fact, they are anti-Christian. An official A.A. publication says, "You can, if you wish, make A.A. itself your 'Higher Power.'"(5) Stafford admits that A.A. founder Bill Wilson "never pledged his loyalty to Christ, never was baptized, never joined a Christian church..."(6) Instead, the Christian church has joined A.A!

Stafford and CT are pleased with A.A. to the point of suggesting that Episcopalian pastor Sam Shoemaker (who mentored Wilson) "may have made his greatest contribution through Wilson."(7) Yet Stafford also writes, "A.A. is pluralistic, recognizing as many gods as there may be religions...."(8) This is a great contribution?

The Willow Creek Community Church of South Barrington, Illinois, pastored by Bill Hybels, is one of thousands of churches sponsoring 12-step programs. Willow Creek has been called "the most influential church in North America"(9) and a model of the church for the twenty-first century. In an exhaustive study of Willow Creek, G.A. Pritchard writes,

One of the first staff members I spoke with proudly told me how more than five hundred individuals met at the church each week in various self-help groups (e.g., Alcoholics Anonymous, Emotions Anonymous, Sexual Anonymous [etc. ]).... One of the requirements of these organizations was that individuals could not evangelize or otherwise teach other participants about God.(10)

Stafford commends 12-step groups for being "tolerant."(11) Should we commend a tolerance for false gods that denies the difference between God's truth and Satan's lie? Note the "tolerant" rules for the 12step programs at Willow Creek:

The Steps suggest a belief in a Power greater than ourselves, "God as we understand Him." The Program does not attempt to tell us what our Higher Power must be.

It can be whatever we choose. For example, human love, a force for good, the group itself, nature, the universe, or the traditional God (Deity).

The code instructs, We never discuss religion."(12)

We are commanded to "earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered to the saints" (Jude 3). How, then, can Willow Creek sponsor the promotion of false gods and false gospels? Stafford says, "Christians [in A.A. groups] can express their convictions." Yet he notes that A.A. does not allow Christians to say anything that would suggest "that others' views of God are misguided."(13) So actually a Christian (like a Mason) is free to say that Jesus is a or his Higher Power, but not "the way, the truth, the life" (Jn 14:6). Why commend this intolerantly anti-Christian "tolerance"?

The truth is that the false gospel of A.A. suppresses the true gospel of Jesus Christ; and the tolerance it professes is only of error, while it remains intolerant of truth. Pritchard comments,

Even church members could not talk about Christian truth in these meetings.... Although the programs give lip service to a "Higher Power," they function as practical atheism, teaching the categories of the contemporary psychological worldview....

That Willow Creek would sponsor and advertise these programs illustrates the church's lack of priority for educating its members in Christian truth(14)

Nevertheless. Stafford writes with approval, "The 12 Steps penetrate every level of American society." That fact is all the more reason to sound the alarm against A.A.'s false god and gospel. Referring to Bill Wilson, Stafford admits that after deliverance from alcohol, "the rest of his life was morally erratic." Yet CT declares, "The 12 Steps are a package of Christian practices and nothing is compromised in using them."(15)

Founder of A.A. Bill Wilson was what the Bible calls a "drunkard" (Prv 23:21; I cor 5:11, etc ). Martin and Deidre Bobgan pick up the story: "After years of struggling with the guilt and condemnation that came from thinking that his drinking was his own fault and that it stemmed from a moral defect in his character, Wilson was relieved to learn from a medical doctor that his drinking was due to an 'allergy.'"(16) A.A.'s official biography of Wilson relates,

Bill listened, entranced. as [Dr.] Silkworth explained his theory. For the first time in his life, Bill was hearing about alcoholism not as a lack of will power, not as a moral defect. but as a legitimate illness....Bill's relief was immense.(17)

Dr. Silkworth's theory might have remained in obscurity had not Bill Wilson founded Alcoholics Anonymous upon it, and millions of drunks, as happy as Wilson to be relieved of accountability to God, turned that theory into a universally accepted axiom. What a relief to exchange the God who judges man's sin for a higher power that judges no one! The fact is, however, that the theory that alcoholism is a disease is false. A leading authority in this field, University of California professor Herbert Fingarette, has written an entire book(18) as well as numerous articles disproving this delusion.

Writing for Harvard Medical School, Fingarette refers to "a mass of scientific evidence...which radically challenges every major belief generally associated with the phrase 'alcoholism is a disease...."(19) Stanton Peele, author of Diseasing of America: Addiction Treatment Out of Control, offers research to show that multitudes have been "brainwashed" to believe they have the disease of alcoholism -and that the result has been to impede the normal recovery which otherwise takes place.(20)

The facts refute Stafford's and CT's false assurance: "We [Christians] ought to use them [12-step programs] gladly. They belong to us originally. They are doing tremendous good"(21) In fact, 12-step programs are doing great harm by turning people away from the true God to a false higher power, and by denying the sufficiency of God's Word and robbing multitudes of its transforming power. It is reprehensible for Christianity Today, Willow Creek, or anyone, to encourage participation in 12-step programs.

Furthermore, A.A. with its higher-power-as-you-understand-it opens the door to occultism. The official A.A. biography of Wilson reveals that for years after A.A's founding, regular seances were still being held in the Wilsons' home, and other occult activities were being pursued:

here are references to seances and other psychic events....

Bill would..."get" these things [from the spirit world]...long sentences, word by word would come through...." (22)

s he started to write [the A.A. manual], he asked for guidance....The words began tumbling out with astonishing speed....(23)

So A.A.'s 12 Steps were actually received verbatim from the demonic world. It is not surprising, then, that the effect of A.A. upon many of its members is to lead them into occult involvement. In 1958, Wilson wrote to Sam Shoemaker,

Throughout A.A., we find a large amount of psychic phenomena, nearly all of it spontaneous. Alcoholic after alcoholic tells me of such experiences...[which] run nearly the full gamut of everything we see in the books.

In addition to my original mystical experience, I've had a lot of such phenomenalism myself.(24)

Wilson's "original mystical experience" was his alleged "conversion" --a classic occult encounter: "Suddenly the room lit up with a great white light. I was caught up into an ecstasy...it burst upon me that I was a free man...a wonderful feeling of Presence, and I thought to myself, 'So this is the God of the preachers! ' A great peace stole over me...."(25)

This was not the "God of the preachers" but the one who transforms himself "into an angel of light" (2 Cor 1l:l4)-a light that often transforms those involved in the occult. The experience was so profound that Wilson never touched alcohol again. Satan would he more than willing to deliver a man from alcoholism in this life if thereby he could ensnare him for eternity and inspire him to lead millions to the same destruction!

Wilson joined the Oxford Group and regularly attended its meetings at Calvary Church (NY), pastored by Episcopalian Sam Shoemaker. Shoemaker urged his hearers to "accept God however they might conceive of him...."(26) Here was the origin of Step 3's "God as we understood him." God does not respond to those who call upon false gods. Jesus said, "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (Jn 17:3). God's judgment comes upon them "that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ (2 Thes 1: .

The Oxford Group had been founded by Frank Buchman (a Lutheran minister). It later became Moral Re-Armament (MRA) through the mystical "guidance" that was a large part of Buchman's life and which carried over both into MRA and A.A.

MRA emphasized a mystical reception of "guidance from God," which recipients would write down and follow as though their thoughts were God's Word to be obeyed. This unbiblical and dangerous procedure is widely practiced even by evangelicals today. British author and former MRA member Roy Livesey writes, "MRA had been a stepping stone for me into the occult."(27) Vineyard members have been trained in much the same way by John Wimber to receive alleged words of knowledge and to prophesy.

The influence of this concept of receiving direct communication from the spirit realm (kept alive in the church today through Richard Foster and others) can be seen in A.A.'s Step 11, which calls for "meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him...." This MRA/AA relationship is acknowledged by Dick B. one of the biographers of the movement.(2

A.A.'s emphasis is upon the "experience" of recovery. In contrast, Christ emphasized truth as revealed in His Word: "If ye continue in my word...ye shall know the truth, and the truth will make you free'' (Jn 8:31-32). Satan insidiously uses mystical experiences for turning men from God's truth to his lies. Tragically, experience and emotion more than the Word of God seem to fuel the latest "revival" centered at the Brownsville Assembly of God in Pensacola, Florida.

MRA founder Frank Buchman compromised the gospel and embraced new revelations through occult guidance. As a result, MRA helped to set the stage for the New Age movement. One of Buchman's close associates during the '40s and '50s writes,

MRA was est and TM. It was consciousness raising and sensitivity. It was encounter and confrontation. Frank Buchman was drying out drunks before A.A's Bill W had his first cocktail He was moving hundreds of people in hotel ballrooms to "share" with each other before Werner Erhard was born. He inspired thousands on all continents to meditate...decades before Maharishi Mahesh Yogi left India. He was indeed Mr. Human Potential. ahead of his time....Paul Tournier...has frequently expressed his debt to Buchman for much of his own approach to counseling...."(29)

MRA became active in more than 50 countries and achieved NGO (NonGovernmental Organization) status with the United Nations, which it enjoys today. Its principal conference center, located in Caux, Switzerland, is a mecca to which world leaders are drawn. The setting, high above Lake Geneva, is exceptionally magnificent even for Switzerland.

While living in the area, our family made several visits to Caux in 1966 and 1967. We met Gandhi's grandson, who was there with an "Up With People" (an MRA offshoot) singing group from India. We spoke with many whose lives had been "transtormed" through impressive spiritual experiences and who had a compelling zeal to "change the world" and used "Christian" phrases, yet didn't seem to know Christ or His Word. MRA and A.A. are tragic reminders of the necessity of adhering to sound doctrine and the need for daily washing in God's Word (Jn 15:3; Eph 5:26). TBC

(Condensed and adapted from Chapter 15 of Occult Invasion) (Fall '97 release)

Endnotes: =================================

1) Tim Stafford, "The Hidden Gospel of the 12 steps: Understanding the origins of the recover movement can help Christians know how to relate to it today"(Christianity Tody, July22,1991),14.

2) Michael G. Maudlin, "Addicts in the Pew" (Christianity Today, July22, 1991),19-21

3) Ibid.

4) Stafford, 14-21

5) Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions (Alcoholic Anonymous World Service, Ind. 1953),26-27

6) Stafford, 18.

7) Ibid., 15

Ibid., 18

9) G.A.Pritchard, Willow Creek Seeker Services (BakerBooks, 1996), inside front cover; quotation of author Lyle E. Schaller

10) Pritchard, 273

11) Stafford, 18.

12) Pritchard, 273

13) Stafford, 18

14) Pritchard, 273

15) Stafford, 18

16) Martin & Deidre Bobgan, 12Steps to Destruction: Codependency Recovery Heresies (EastGate Publishers,1991),72

17) Kurtz, Pass It On; The Story of Bill Wilson and how the A.A.message reached the world (Alcoholics Anonymous World Service,Inc.,1984),102;cited in Bobgan,72.

1 Herbert Fingarette, Heavy Drinking: The Myth of Alcoholism as a Disease (University of California Press,198

19) Herber Fingarette, "We Should Reject the Disease Concept of Alcoholism" (The Harvard Medical School Mental Health Letter, Feb.1990),4

20) Stanton Peel, Deseasing of America: Addiction Treatment Out of Control (Heath and Company,1989),27

21) Stafford,19

22) Kurtz,276-79

23) Ibid.,198

24) Ibid.,374

25) Stafford, 14; see also Kurtz,121

26) Stafford, 16

27) Roy Livesey, Twelve Steps to the New Age (Bury House Books, 1995; unpublished manuscript),21-22

2 Dick B. Anne Smith's Spiritual Workbook (Good Book Publishing Co.,1992),45

29) Willard Hunter, The Man Who Would Change the World: Frank Buchman and Moral ReArmament (unpublished manuscript,1977),110-111; cited in Livesey,88-89


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Forum, does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com

I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic

Steven

Re: A.A. and Twelve Steps demonically inspired

Very interesting and informative articles, Steven...I've always suspected as much about AA, but never read anything nearly as definitive on it as these articles! Thanks for opening our eyes to the deception here!