Hi Pattie,

I got to thinking over what you said that Jesus began to open the seals as soon as He got to heaven but what does the Bible says regarding when they would be opened? Nothing is said about those seals until we get into the final book, the Book of Revelation, which is Jesus revealing what must take place. The first chapter doesn't have the seals opened yet. let's see what the second chapter tells us. Jesus is still speaking to the churches until chapter 4. tells us about the Throne Room and all that John saw but it wasn't until Chapter 5 that we first hear about the scroll. Now, let's see what is written about those scroll:

The Lamb Takes the Scroll

Revelation

5:1 And I saw in the right hand of Him who sat on the throne a scroll written inside and on the back, sealed with seven seals. 2 Then I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, “Who is worthy to open the scroll and to loose its seals?” 3 And no one in heaven or on the earth or under the earth was able to open the scroll, or to look at it.

4 So I wept much, because no one was found worthy to open and read the scroll, or to look at it. 5 But one of the elders said to me, “Do not weep. Behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has prevailed to open the scroll and to loose its seven seals.”

6 And I looked, and behold, in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as though it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent out into all the earth. 7 Then He came and took the scroll out of the right hand of Him who sat on the throne.

Worthy Is the Lamb

8 Now when He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each having a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. 9 And they sang a new song, saying:


“You are worthy to take the scroll,
And to open its seals;
For You were slain,
And have redeemed us to God by Your blood
Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,

10
And have made us kings and priests to our God;
And we shall reign on the earth.”

11 Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne, the living creatures, and the elders; and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands, 12 saying with a loud voice:


“Worthy is the Lamb who was slain
To receive power and riches and wisdom,
And strength and honor and glory and blessing!”

13 And every creature which is in heaven and on the earth and under the earth and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, I heard saying:


“Blessing and honor and glory and power
Be to Him who sits on the throne,
And to the Lamb, forever and ever!”

14 Then the four living creatures said, “Amen!” And the twenty-four elders fell down and worshiped Him who lives forever and ever.

Now we get to the part where Jesus Christ is going to open the seals.

6 Now I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals; and I heard one of the four living creatures saying with a voice like thunder, “Come and see.” 2 And I looked, and behold, a white horse. He who sat on it had a bow; and a crown was given to him, and he went out conquering and to conquer.

Second Seal: Conflict on Earth

3 When He opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, “Come and see.” 4 Another horse, fiery red, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.

Jesus is still opening the seals and he didn't open one on himself nor his Holy Spirit to ride that horse. The Holy Spirit's purpose is to lift up Jesus Christ not to take his place riding upon a horse leading three wicked horsemen.

Third Seal: Scarcity on Earth

5 When He opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, “Come and see.” So I looked, and behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, “A quart of wheat for a denarius, and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the oil and the wine.”

Fourth Seal: Widespread Death on Earth

7 When He opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature saying, “Come and see.” 8 So I looked, and behold, a pale horse. And the name of him who sat on it was Death, and Hades followed with him. And power was given to them over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, with hunger, with death, and by the beasts of the earth.

Fifth Seal: The Cry of the Martyrs

9 When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

Sixth Seal: Cosmic Disturbances

12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. 13 And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. 14 Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place. 15 And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, 16 and said to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?” (Notice that Wrath is now mentioned)

The Holy Spirit is within us during this time, not riding a white horse at the head of a wicked pack bent on taking peace from the earth, to out conquering. That is what is taking place at this time as we see this Beast leading his pack into all the parts of the world to conquer piece by piece, disposing king after king. With his going forth with a limited amount of arsenal allowed by God as evidenced in having only a bow, there follow the other three that cause war, economic collapse and finally the pestilence that destroy lives.

When we see Jesus Christ coming on His white horse it is later in Chapter 19:11 "And I saw heaven opened and behold a white horse and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.?

Pati, The Holy Spirit's purpose is to be a comfort to us during his absence, not to be the first horsemen of evil takeover whereby the war horse follow, with the black horse of economic woe and then death following quickly after. It is my belief that the last horseman is getting his saddle on now to pour out his pestilence.

sincerely,
gerlinda

Hi Gerlinda,

Let me try and answer your response with what I understand is happening in Rev. 5. I covered this already in my study but it bears repeating and maybe clarifying. The book of Revelation is the Revelation of Jesus Christ, from His ascension until His Second Coming. What John is seeing in Rev.5 is a pre-Christ heaven, or heaven before Christ ascended. Why else is he weeping when no one is found to open the sealed book?

“And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof? And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.” Rev 5:2 -4

The New Testament speaks much about Pentecost on earth, what occurs in this chapter is a view of what happened at Pentecost in heaven. This is a view of Jesus ascending to heaven and sending the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, as promised to his disciples. He sent what the Church needed to overcome the world and the tribulation thereof.

The rest of the seals depict what the Church will endure before His second coming, and how through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit they will be able to overcome these tribulations and be able to stand until He returns.

Jesus is reclaiming the earth from Satan’s influence…why would he send the Antichrist? Why would he send evil? Evil is already in the world. He is sending the only weapon that will overcome the attacks of the world…Himself in Spirit as the Holy Spirit. He already gave His body, now He sends His Spirit. The only way His believers will overcome War, Famine, and physical death will be to be made alive by the Holy Spirit in which they attain eternal life, and therefore need not worry about losing their physical life. The other seals are the tools of the devil that Christ allows to be used against the church…war, famine, disease and death….which believers are not to fear and are able to endure by having the Holy Spirit living in them. This also denotes the war between flesh and spirit in each person.

Jesus tells us that we will have tribulation in the world...but to be of good cheer because He overcame the world, and we as born again believers will also be able to overcome the world with His help...via His Spirit, the Holy Spirit, living inside us. Wars, famine, disease and death have always been in this world, they are not just something that happens in the end times!! These things may intensify, but they have always been in this world.

The book of Revelation is not just about the end times, much of it has been fulfilled. It is much more about Jesus and His Church and what He did to redeem His people. From His ascension to His Second Coming…His story….history. We are very close to His Second Coming, very little of the book is still future…we need to keep this in mind. We make too much of this book being about the antichrist, when in all actuality it is the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Right now the Church is between the 5th and 6th seals...as stated in my post about the first 5 seals being opened.

We are seeing this from such different perspectives we may not find common ground. This is an interesting discussion and one that offers interesting insights into both sides of this issue. Thanks for participating in it.

JESUS IS ALL AND EVERYTHING!!

Patti C.