Dear Bruce,

I hope you will forgive me if this response seems harsh, but please understand that I am taking the time to respond because I care, not because I do not. I have tried many times to address this issue with you, to no avail, as you never answer me, or even acknowledge my responses to your studies. It makes it difficult to carry on a discussion of an issue with only one side involved.

I think you are mistaken about who you see Israel to be. There are so many excellent studies that clarify this misunderstanding of Israel being just the Jews, many posted right here on this site, easy to find and read. Before one can believe what you are putting forth here, you have to prove who Israel really is. Once you see who they are, the rest of the Scriptures, that deal with them, will become much clearer. This is such a foundation stone, that if it is not understood first, it can lead to so many other errors in rightly dividing the Word. Can you prove Biblically that Israel is only speaking of the Jewish people?? If so, please do that, I would be really interested in seeing that study, as I am sure many others would be, too.

That being said, I would like to include a part of one of my studies into this, that speaks of this "third part", that you are addressing in your letter. Israel is God's chosen people, not the Jews. Unless a Jewish person is Born Again, he is not considered to be part of God's chosen people, Israel, His Church. It is not about flesh and blood, but is only about Spirit, and being born again from above in Spirit and in Truth!! God did not send His Son to save anyone because of race, or ethnic background...He sent Him to save the souls of all people, and all those who are born again, are RESURRECTED IN CHRIST, spiritually first....this is the first resurrection, and they will have a new body when all are resurrected at the Second Resurrection, at the Judgment on the Last Day.

################


Zechariah 13:8-9

8 – And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, .therein.

9 – And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

What does Scripture tell us about what this third part will endure?

1. God will bring them through the fire.

In Daniel’s allegory of eternal hell, we discover that these three servants of God were thrown into the fiery furnace, which was exceedingly hot! So hot that its flame slew those men who were ordered to throw the Hebrews into the fire (Daniel 3:22).

Nebuchadnezzar saw in this furnace, as we read in Daniel 3:25: “…lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt ; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God”.

Yes, Christ did appear in this fiery furnace with His three servants and literally protected and saved them from the flames.

1Pe 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

2. God will refine them as silver is refined.

This word “refine” in the Hebrew language comes from a word meaning to make pure or to purge away. This has everything to do with God’s conditioning of His own temple of believers.

Psalms 51:7 – ¶Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.

Hebrew 1:3 – Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Hebrews 9:22 – And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Matthew 3:12 – Whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

3. God will try them as gold is tried.

Now let us deal with its third phrase, that of gold, which is a descriptive noun signifying purity.

Job 23:10 – But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.

Psalm 21:3 – For thou preventest him with the blessings of goodness: thou settest a crown of pure gold on his head.

Malachi 3:3 – And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.

Revelation 3:18 – I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

Revelation 4:4 – And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Revelation 21:18 – And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.

Revelation 21:21 – And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.

4. THEY SHALL CALL MY NAME, AND I WILL HEAR THEM. I WILL SAY; IT IS MY PEOPLE; AND THEY SHALL SAY, THE LORD IS MY GOD.

Psalm 34:17 – “The righteous cry, and the Lord heareth, and delivereth them out of all their troubles,”

Proverbs 15:29 – "The LORD is far from the wicked: but he heareth the prayer of the righteous.

John 9:31 – Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.

1 John 5:14 – ¶And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:

“They shall call my name, and I will hear them…,” God declares!

Yes, the third part is absolutely symbolic of the true body of believers in Christ. “They shall say, the Lord is my God,” and God shall say “it is My people.” Zechariah 13:9 states that God will try the third part as gold is tried.

This is what Zechariah is making reference to as he speaks concerning the third part being taken through the purifying process of trials and tribulations, that the true Church might be refined as silver is refined, and tried as gold is tried.

God has promised to bring His third part through this un- quenchable fire, just as He brought Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego through the fire in Daniel chapter three.

God has promised to bring this third part through hell itself, represented by the fire. Christ accomplished this at the cross. God has promised to refine this third part as silver is refined. We have discovered that the word refine is defined in the Hebrew as to make pure or to purge away. God has indeed purged away our sins and made all believers pure in His sight, only because we are covered with the righteousness of Christ. Let us now look closer at this word “refine” to examine just what its other Hebrew meanings portray.

REFINE, in addition to meaning purge is also translated melt and try.

Jeremiah 9:7 – “Therefore thus saith the Lord of hosts, behold, I will melt them, and try them; for how shall I do for the daughter of my people?”

Psalm 66:10 – “For thou, O God, hast proved us; thou hast tried us, as silver is tried.”

Psalm 13:3 – Thou hast proved mine heart; thou hast visited me in the night; thou hast tried me, and shalt find nothing; I am purposed that my mouth shall not transgress.

Psalms 105:17-19 -

17 – He sent a man before them, even Joseph, who was sold for a servant:

18 – Whose feet they hurt with fetters: he was laid in iron:

19 – Until the time that his word came: the word of the LORD tried him.

Christ has passed through eternal hell for us; He has brought us through the fire. As a result of this, He promises to refine us, meaning to try, purge, or melt us, – as silver is refined.

Psalm 12:6 – The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.


A third of the angels fell with Satan, are the chosen third of God to replace them? Not as angels, but as redeemed worshipers, and kings and priests. Could that be why the devil hates us so much!! Jesus was tempted by the devil, what makes us think that we will not go through the same thing?

Rev 12:3 " And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads."

Rev 12:4 "And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born."

(Interesting study looking into this third part, as it is used to describe so very much of what happens to the earth and heavens during the Tribulation. It seems to be reflected in an evil way, with the third of the fallen angels, and in a spiritual pure way with the third part of God's chosen people. And this is then reflected in the earth, moon, rivers, sea etc.)

If Jesus is delayed, and the foolish virgins lose their blessed hope, when the Rapture does not happen before the Man of Sin is revealed and the mark of the beast enforced, will they lose hope to the point of rejoining the world so as not to have their heads cut off?

###############

There is no Pre-Trib Rapture, we are all raptured at the Second Coming and then judged. Yet, we will be protected during the Great Tribulation, and preach the Gospel to the ends of the earth until Christ comes. I hope you will at least look into the studies that so many have worked hard to provide. It is because I care about you that I tell you all this, if I did not, I would not bother to keep responding, especially when I get no answers from you.

May the Lord keep you, and bless you, and lead you to what He wants you to know, and guide you to share His truth with others.

JESUS IS ALL AND EVERYTHING ESPECIALLY OUR BLESSED HOPE!!

Your sister in Christ,
Patti C.

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Hi, my Christian sister, Patti,



You said to me, "I have tried many times to address this issue with you, to no avail, as you never answer me, or even acknowledge my response to your studies. It makes it difficult to carry on a discussion of an issue with only one side involved."



With all Christian brotherly love for you, Patti, my response to you is found in the following Holy Scripture:



1Timothy 2:11-12

"Let a woman learn in silence with all submission. And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence."



You can feel sorry for my wife.



According to Your Infallible Word, come Lord Jesus !



Bruce Warner, Scripturalist

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum, ( http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com ) does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

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Ybic
Steven

Dear Brother Bruce,

Thank you so much for finally answering me. I guess I should not be surprised by your excuse not to debate the issues, as it was the easy way out. Just for the record, you will not prove that the Jewish people are Israel because you are a man and I am a woman? It would be you, a man, teaching me, a woman. I am not a preacher, or a teacher getting up in a Church to preach or teach. I am a fellow servant of the Lord, asking another servant to explain how he came to the conclusion that he did. In that regard, I do not think that the quote from Timothy is really appropriate in this matter.

Yet, since the Lord put it on your heart to share that Scripture with me, I feel it only fitting to share the Scriptures He put on my heart to share with you. In these end times, the Lord is in the midst of His People like never before. And this is what He tells us through His prophet Joel about these days. Please note that He is pouring out His Spirit upon all flesh, male and female.

Joe 2:27
"And ye shall know that I am in the midst of Israel, and that I am the LORD your God, and none else: and my people shall never be ashamed.

Joe 2:28
"And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon ALL FLESH; and your sons and your DAUGHTERS shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

Joe 2:29
"And also upon the servants and upon the HANDMAIDS in those days will I pour out my spirit."

Joe 2:30
"And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke."

Joe 2:31
"The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come."

Joe 2:32
"And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call. "

And, the Lord also put it on my heart to send you some verses from Proverbs. It is interesting that the Lord calls Wisdom a SHE. Not to say, by any means, that I am wise, but if we let the Lord guide us in our studies, no matter if we be men or women, He will guide us to all Truth. I am asking you to search His Word for the truth, not to believe mine!


Pro 1:20
"Wisdom crieth without; SHE uttereth her voice in the streets:

Pro 1:21
"SHE crieth in the chief place of concourse, in the openings of the gates: in the city SHE uttereth HER words, saying,

Pro 1:22
" How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge? "

Pro 1:23
"Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you."

Pro 1:24
"Because I have called, and ye refused; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded;"

Pro 1:25
"But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof:

Pro 1:26
" I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh;"

Pro 1:27
"When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you.

Pro 1:28
"Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me:

Pro 1:29
" For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD:

Pro 1:30
"They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof.

Pro 1:31
Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices.

Pro 1:32
For the turning away of the simple shall slay them, and the prosperity of fools shall destroy them.

Pro 1:33
But WHOSO hearkeneth unto me shall dwell safely, and shall be quiet from fear of evil.

Please note that the Lord says WHOSO...meaning everyone, male or female.

Bruce, in all honesty, you have to know that refusing to prove your findings, and share them with a fellow Christian, has nothing to do with gender and is a thin excuse to not consider what I have to say.

Yet, thanks for making some kind of effort to explain your non-response.

YSIC
Patti C.

P.S. I do feel so very sorry for your wife....God bless her!!

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Hi again my sister Patti,



What a great response to me ! But because you have chosen to ignore the Lord's command for you to "learn in silence with all submission and to remain in silence", I will leave you with this Proverb which you may also be in contention with:



Proverbs 27:15-16

"A continual dripping on a very rainy day and a contentious woman are alike; whoever restrains her restrains the wind, and grasps oil with his right hand."





God is the Author of all Scripture. All Scriptures apply all the time !



According to Your Infallible Word in 1 Timothy 2:11-12 and Proverbs 27:15-16 , come Lord Jesus !





Your brother in Christ, Bruce Warner

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum, ( http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com ) does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com
I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic
Steven

Wow Bruce!

Just who do you think you are? Does your arrogance know no bounds?

You have absolutely no right to tell me to be silent, and stand by as you put out misinformation about God's Holy Word!! And to use His Holy Word to demean me, is just lower than low! I am not a woman under your submission, nor am I in a church preaching to a congregation, I am in no way disobeying the Lord. You are asking me to respect what you have to say, while being so disrespectful to me.

This is the Scripture the Lord put on my heart to send to you. Don't worry I will never again waste my time even reading your posts let alone respond to them. Is that silent enough for you?


Mat 7:6
"Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you."

I guess I found out what your rending felt like. Not impressed with your Holy man facade, at least I found out what is underneath it.

Patti C.

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WHY IS THE CHURCH REFERRED TO IN SCRIPTURE AS THE "BRIDE OF CHRIST" ???





Also why is Jesus Christ referred to in the Scriptures as the Bridegroom ?? Could it be because the relationship between Jesus and His Church/bride is likened to the HOLY relationship between a husband and his bride ? The raptured Church/bride will attend the wedding in heaven before returning with Jesus, the Bridegroom, at His Second Coming. Take note of that fact, Patti C. First comes the rapture, then the wedding in heaven, and then the Second Coming.



So you see, the human bride is commanded by Scripture, ie. the Word of God, to be subservient to her husband just as the Church/bride is subservient to Jesus the Bridegroom. THAT IS THE HOLY DOCTRINE OF CHRIST !!! You cannot have it your own way, or if you insist, you will suffer the consequences. You are not allowed to rewrite the Scriptures or you are in danger of being a tare.



2 John 9

"Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. "





According to Your Infallible Word, and no one else, come Lord Jesus !



Bruce Warner, Scripturalist

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum, ( http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com ) does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com
I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic
Steven

For Fair Use Discussion and Educational Purposes
Link: PER EMAIL FROM BRUCE WARNER
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Hi Patti,



That's a great Scripture you quoted to me about the pearls and the swine ! I love that Scripture as I love ALL the Scriptures. We sure are having fun learning lots of Scriptures now, are we not? Think about it Patti, you are not disagreeing with me, but rather you are disagreeing with the Holy Scriptures which I am posting for you to read. Do not disagree with Holy Scripture because that is what the tares do, and we know what happens to them. We must accept the Holy Scriptures as they are presented to us in the Bible without compromise.





According to Your Infallible Word just as it is written, come Lord Jesus !



Bruce Warner, Scripturalist

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum, ( http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com ) does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com
I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic
Steven

For Fair Use Discussion and Educational Purposes
Link: PER EMAIL FROM BRUCE WARNER
Note: Before commenting on any posts please make sure you either watch or read each post in it’s entirety. Before, making a comment, if you don’t have the time to watch or read fully please restrain from commenting. When you do this it will help to reduce confusion.

Thank you for visiting Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum!

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B Warner

ToSteven Sandiego






NOT ALL MATRIMONY IS 'HOLY MATRIMONY'.....





The only matrimony that is Holy matrimony is that matrimony which conforms to the parameters set out for Holy matrimony in the Scriptures where the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the Church. All other matrimony is only secular matrimony. Sadly these days most matrimony is secular matrimony even if it is preformed in a church building by a minister. That is why the divorce rate is so high. It is a rare woman who chooses Holy matrimony over secular matrimony where the wife is the equal of the husband. The Church/bride will never be the equal of the Bridegroom who is Jesus Christ.





According To your Infallible Word, come Lord Jesus !



Bruce Warner, Scripturalist

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Disclaimer: Rapture Bible Prophecy Forum, ( http://www.rapturebibleprophecyforum.com ) does not necessarily endorse or agree with every opinion expressed in every article posted on this site. We do however, encourage a healthy and friendly debate on the issues of our day. Whether you agree or disagree, we encourage you to post your feedback by using the reply button.

If you are new to this site and would like to post articles, opinions, youtube videos that are appropriate for this site just e mail me at

stevensandiego@ymail.com
I will send you a PASSWORD

Ybic
Steven