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Marilyn Agee (20 Dec 2011)
"Re: Pentecost, May 29, 2009: "The rapture is not going to occur as you have always been taught""



Hi:

> > I was taught pre-trib and a simultaneous event occuring in the twinkling of an eye. Then the 7-year tribulation with the temple being rebuilt in the city of Jerusalem, with the second coming at the end of the 7 years where every eye will see Him arriving in the sky, along with the saints who had been raptured returning with Him.

I first read about the Rapture and thought it was as you describe, one Rapture then the Second Advent. However, as I kept reading the scriptures, I suddenly realized that there are two Raptures, a First-Trump Rapture (I Thess 4:16,17) and a Last-Trump Rapture (I Cor 15:51-54). How can there be a last unless there is a first?

This is something different from what you were taught.

THE FIRST-TRUMP RAPTURE

1Th 4:16,17 says, "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with THE TRUMP of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

Revelation is arranged around the first Rapture, around Rev 4:1. Verse 1:19 says, "Write the things which thou hast seen (i.e., before the first Rapture, before Rev 4:1), and the things which are (i.e., at the time of the first Rapture, at Rev 4:1), and the things which shall be hereafter" (after the first Rapture, after Rev 4:1).
Rev 4:1-4 says, "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither (i.e., at the first Rapture), and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. (i.e., after the first Rapture). 2 And immediately I was (lit., became) in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one (Christ) sat on the throne. 3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper (first stone in the breastplate) and a sardine stone (last stone in the breastplate, i.e., Jesus is the first, LORD of the Old Testament, and the last, Lord of the New Testament, Isa 44:6): and there was a rainbow (i.e., Saturn's ring system) round about the throne (of the only God/man, on Saturn that has brightness all around, Eze 1:1,26-2 , in sight like unto an emerald (Judah's stone in the breastplate, i.e., Jesus is the Lion of the Tribe of Judah). 4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats (lit., thrones): and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders (i.e., 12 patriarchs and 12 apostles of Israel, including John) sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold."

THE LAST-TRUMP RAPTURE

1Co 15:51-53 says, "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the LAST TRUMP: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality."

After the second Rapture, Rev 7:13,14 says, "And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation (i.e., at the second Rapture on the Day of God's Wrath, Rev 6:17), and have washed their robes (the first group caught up were wearing white robes), and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

Rev 14:1-5 says, "And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand (having been caught up in the second Rapture), having his Father's name written in their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: 3 And they sung as it were a new song (as in Rev 1:9) before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man (including the foolish virgins) could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for THEY ARE VIRGINS (i.e., added to the Bride group who are the wise virgins). These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the FIRSTFRUITS unto God and to the Lamb (i.e., to Christ, the God/man). 5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are WITHOUT FAULT before the throne of God."

At the First-Trump Rapture, the Bride of Christ becomes incorruptible. At the Last-Trump Rapture, the Tribulation saints become incorruptible, then all the saints become immortal in the twinkling of an eye.

1Th 4:16,,17 says, "For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with THE TRUMP of God (i.e., the first trump): and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 THEN we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

It actually says nothing about the first Rapture happening in the twinkling of an eye. That is when the entire Body of Christ will become immortal at the last Rapture.

I looked up the Greek for "THEN". It says,
G1899 epeita From G1909 and G1534; thereafter: - after that (-ward), then. G1909, epi, can mean after. G1534, ieta, means after that.

The word translated "then" can mean AFTERWARD, or AFTER THAT. Therefore, the dead in Christ could have been raised up on Pentecost, May 29, 2009, the day the Tribulation started.

THE TYPE OF THE TWO RAPTURES

Num 10:1-4 says, "And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Make thee TWO TRUMPETS of silver; of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest use them (i.e., both) for the calling of the assembly (i.e., the General Assembly in Heaven on the day of the last Rapture, Heb 12:22,23), and for the journeying of the camps (i.e., one from Earth, the Tribulation saints, Mark 13:27, one from Heaven, those caught up to Heaven previously, Mt 24:31, I Thess 4:16,17). 3 And when they shall blow with them (i.e., both), all (i.e., the saints of both Raptures) the assembly shall assemble themselves to thee at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation. 4 And if they blow but with ONE TRUMPET, then the princes (i.e., the 24 elders), which are heads of the thousands (i.e., the 144,000) of Israel, shall gather themselves unto thee" (Rev 4:1-4).

The "Come up hither" of Rev 4:1 represents the First-Trump Rapture. It says, "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, COME UP HITHER, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter."

The "Come up hither" of Rev 11:12 represents the Last-Trump Rapture. It takes place on the Day of God's Wrath, Rev 6:17;7:14.

There are three woes at the end of the Tribulation. Rev 9:12 says, "One woe is past; and, behold, there come two woes more hereafter."

In Rev 11:1-3, the Temple is present, so it is the last half of the Tribulation. It says, "And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months (i.e., the last half of the Tribulation, while the believing Jews are in Petra). 3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days (i.e., during the last half of the Tribulation), clothed in sackcloth."


Rev 11:12-15 says, "And they (God's two witnesses) heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, COME UP HITHER. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud (probably representing the huge number of saints that will be caught up in the last Rapture); and their enemies beheld them. 13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake (i.e., when the asteroid of Rev 8:8 will impact the Mediterranean Sea), and the tenth part of the city (i.e., Jerusalem) fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven. 14 The SECOND WOE IS PAST; and, behold, THE THIRD WOE COMETH QUICKLY. 15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever."

I think that day will be the Feast of Trumpets, Tishri 1, 5776, Sept 14, 2015.

Rev 11:18 says, "And the nations were angry, and THY WRATH IS COME, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest GIVE REWARD (i.e., at the Judgment Seat of Christ) unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; AND SHOULDEST DESTROY THEM WHICH DESTROY THE EARTH."

I hope we will be caught up at the first Rapture to meet Christ and the dead in Christ on Hanukkah, which starts Dec 21, 2011. The Church was born on Pentecost. It is the Temple of the Holy Spirit, and the Dedication of the Temple was on Kislev 25, the day after Kislev 24, the day of Jesus' Conception (Hag 2:18,19), when the seed (Christ, Gen 3:15) was "in the barn" (meaning, in the womb).

Hanukkah is the 8th feast, and 8 is Jesus' number. It also means new beginning, and the Rapture will certainly be a new beginning for us. The number 21 is 7 + 7 + 7, and 7 is God's number of completion and perfection.

We are the Temple of the Holy Spirit. After we are gone, the physical Temple can be built. The False Prophet is to sit in the Temple as if he is God at Mid-Trib. That could be at the Dedication of the Temple. Therefore, we should be raptured soon so the physical Temple can be built.

The oil ties the wise virgins of Mt 25 to the Dedication of the Temple too. The consecrated oil for one day lasted 8 days. Olives are harvested up to Hanukkah. None are harvested after that. It takes 8 days to make fresh pure oil for the Menorrah. Are we the Olive harvest?

Of Kislev 24, Hag 2:19 says, "Is the seed (i.e., Jesus, Gen 3:15) yet in the barn? (meaning is she pregnant) yea (YES, Jesus was conceived on Kislev 24), as yet the vine (Christ), and the fig tree (Israel), and the pomegranate (meaning the upright), and the OLIVE tree (i.e., with the Gentiles grafted in), hath not brought forth: from (i.e., after) this day (i.e., on Kislev 25) will I bless you."

The olive tree being blessed ties in with the olive oil for one day lasting 8 days. Having enough olive oil ties in with the wise virgins that are caught up in the first Rapture.

1Cor 15:51-54 refers to the second Rapture. It says, "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all (i.e., including Paul) be changed (i.e., become immortal), 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, AT THE LAST TRUMP (i.e., not at the first trump): for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we (i.e., the whole Body of Christ) shall be CHANGED. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption (i.e., this happens at each Rapture), and this mortal must put on immortality (this only happens at the last Rapture). 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, AND this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory."

At the last Rapture, the whole Body of Christ, including those caught up in the first Rapture, will be changed, actually become immortal, in the twinkling of an eye.

> > I might add that from my experience that day, 5/29/2009, something very significant occurred in the spiritual realm on that day. I think the rapture began and will culminate when those of us who are "alive and remain" will be caught up. Actually that phrase is worded very interestingly also..... "alive and remain".


I looked up "remain."

per-ee-li'-po, From G4012 and G3007; to leave all around, that is, (passively) survive: - remain.


That could be us. We are alive and remain past the time when we expected to be caught up.

Luke 21:25-36 is still what we hang our hopes on. It says, "And there shall be SIGNS in the sun (CMEs and Solar Eclipses), and in the moon (i.e., Lunar Eclipses, Blood Moons), and in the stars (comets like Elenin, asteroids like YU55 whizzing by between the Earth and Moon); and upon the earth distress of nations (wars, terrorism, financial troubles, floods, blizzards, hurricanes, radiation), with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring (i.e., Japan's tsunami, Mar 11, 2011); 26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming (including the Day of God's Wrath) on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken (i.e., the two asteroids of Rev 8:8-11 will hit Earth on the Day of God's Wrath). 27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud (i.e., the Sign of the Son of Man will be seen in the sky on the Day of God's Wrath) with power and great glory. 28 And when these things BEGIN (Japan's tsunami was Mar 11, 2011) to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. 29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree (Israel), and all the trees (i.e., surrounding nations); 30 When they now shoot forth (i.e., in the Six-Day War), ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand (the Six-Day War was June 5-10, summer started June 21). 31 So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand. 32 Verily I say unto you, This generation (48.33 years, Mt 1:17) shall not pass away (i.e., as in 2015.33 or Tishri 1, 5776, Sept 14, 2015), till all be fulfilled (i.e., including the Day of God's Wrath). 33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away. 34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day (i.e., Day of God's Wrath) come upon you unawares. 35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. 36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to ESCAPE (i.e., by being raptured) all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man."



The two Raptures are the believer's escapes. I want to be in the first group. They are the Bride of Christ. They escape all these things. Of the last group, only the 144,000 are added to the Bride group (Rev 14:1-5). The key is that the Bride sings the NEW SONG.


BTW, Obama signaled that he is not one of us. Look at what he did to the Hanukkah menorah.



You can see that Obama's Hanukkah Menorrah has had another candleholder attached lower in front of the original central elevated one.

That's because the central elevated servant candle actually stands for Christ, the light of the world. All the other candles are lit by the central one. Obama is showing us that he is not for elevating Christ. He is for the opposite.

> > I will pray for you Marilyn and for your husband... I do understand the heartache of caring for a spouse who is suffering and weakening.

Thanks much.


Agape,
Marilyn Agee
mjagee@verizon.net
http://prophecycorner.theforeverfamily.com

----- Original Message -----
From: jengman@q.com
To: Edgar Agee
Sent: Monday, December 12, 2011 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: Pentecost, May 29, 2009: "The rapture is not going to occur as you have always been taught"


Good Morning Marilyn,

I was very happy to hear from you... Thank you for taking the time to respond.

First, to answer your question about how I have been taught.... I was taught pre-trib and a simultaneous event occuring in the twinkling of an eye. Then the 7-year tribulation with the temple being rebuilt in the city of Jerusalem, with the second coming at the end of the 7 years where every eye will see Him arriving in the sky, along with the saints who had been raptured returning with Him.

I agree with you that we are in the first half of the 7-year tribulation period now. In reflecting on the events occurring in the Revelation, it does seem to fit the great tribulation being 3.5 years - With the magnitude of what is described, it just feels that 7 years would be a tremendously long time to endure what will occur. We have been seeing so many major earthquakes and weather changes. I just don't feel too inclined to watch the news and to follow the world power maneuvering, but I do sense in my spirit that things are being very much put in place to fit total control of mankind by a world system, and ultimately by the antichrist. We are probably at that point now, with all things in place when the rapture occurs and total chaos takes over (even more than now)!



I might add that from my experience that day, 5/29/2009, something very significant occurred in the spiritual realm on that day. I think the rapture began and will culminate when those of us who are "alive and remain" will be caught up. Actually that phrase is worded very interestingly also..... "alive and remain".



I am including a link from a posting on Five Doves from August 1, 2010, from a man by the name Ray Schulz, who relates an experience that I feel very much was tied into the experience that I had on May 29, 2009.
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/aug2010/rays82-2.htm
I always look for his posts now on Five Doves because of this experience. What a wonderful Savior and Lord we have. When I see His hand moving and how He uses the saints to cooperate with the Holy Spirit as His Will is brought about in the lives of His Church (we who are alive and being used as an active part of His ministry on earth at this particular point in time), I just want to bow down and worship Him with praise and thanksgiving, and then cherish the very thought of being around His throne in heaven when the time has finally arrived .... What a day that will be!!

I will pray for you Marilyn and for your husband... I do understand the heartache of caring for a spouse who is suffering and weakening. I would like to share a picture of my dear darling Allen and I on a sunny day here in Florence, OR. I had taken him out for a drive several months before his death. He loved to ride with me and to drink his mochas.... This will be the first Christmas without him in 38 years.... and it would me the very desire of my heart to spend it with Him, Jesus, and the saints of the ages in our heavenly home... God's Will be done.

I will include the link to the picture, that way we will know one another in Heaven, even though I have a feeling we will probably know each other anyway....


God Bless you Marilyn today and always... Please stay in touch, and I will continue to look for your posts on Five Doves. Thanks too for sending the Vincent Tan encounter - I had read it before, but a while ago and I have printed it off and will re-read it during my devotion time this evening.



Love from your sister in Christ,

Jeanne Engman


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Zechariah 12:3,9:
And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people; And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.


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