Just wanted to see if you all can input pros and cons between AMERISOURCEBERGEN and CARDINAL wholesalers. I would greatly appreciate your replies...
thanks.

Name of Facility: San Joaquin Community Hospital

Please don't publish!

Until May 1, I was using ABC (since 1998), now we are with Cardinal. No one will surpass ABC in customer service-they are tops! Their customer service reps were assigned accounts and I dealt with the same person each time I called (a big plus in my book).Cardinal customer service is all based in a few national centers, but I requested a dedicated rep and got one!!!

Otherwise it's a little hard to compare since I was using Windows based ordering with ABC; Cardinal is an online system.

For running reports, again ABC (Windows)is great! Their internet reports are so-so, same with Cardinal (my rep acknowledges this!)There are ways to access the info, just a more complicated.

There are a couple of things that ABC does that Cardinal doesn't that I really appreciate: 1) the price stickers show the quantity ordered each time. Big help, esp. when I'm not here and the RPh/tech has no idea how much to get.

2)A "u" shows up after any item number that has been ordered. Again, a huge help when I'm not here. If a sticker is missing, for instance, a person can type in "amiodarone" and the previously ordered line items will show up with that annotation, which narrows down the field considerably. Cardinal can't/won't do either of these for some resaon, even though my rep has made multiple requests.

Another buyer here in Indiana made the change from ABC to Cardinal a few months before we did. She is using Cardinal Choice (which they don't offer any more) instead of Cardinal.com and she HATES it! I've just adjusted, since I didn't have an option.

I also have a fabulous account rep; if there is something he doesn't know, he'll find out ASAP and get back to me. That makes all the difference. Although I have had great reps with ABC, too.

I hope this helps. If I think of any else, I'll let you know!

Ruth

Name of Facility: PORTER

Years as a Buyer: 9+

I would be interested in knowing how you service as far as drug supply is with Cardinal vs Amerisource. We have been with Amerisource for years and years and I am thinking of changing to Cardinal because the service level has dropped quit a bit from Amerisource. Customer service is good, our rep is not nor is our delivery or their stock levels. Several times they have been out of stock calling it a manufacturer backorder only to find out there is plenty of stock at the companies but that Amerisource has not placed orders. I would be very interested in finding out which one people prefer.

Years as a Buyer: 16+ (tech 33+

Please don't publish

When I first became the buyer here, we were using Cardinal, but rarely saw an acct rep and when one did come in it was someone different from the last time. My director decided to switch to ABC and the rep then was super. He held my hand, so to speak through the whole transition and taught me so much about using ECHO for Windows. At that time the customer service was wonderful, I had a dedicated rep who became a friend, too.

With the sale of our facility this spring, we had to change to Cardinal. I was pretty apprehensive (bad memories), but my guy, Jason, is terrific. He is so knowledgeable and friendly. We have a really great working relationship. Thd terrible news this week for me is that he is taking a promotion at Cardinal is taking over Kentucky as his territory (any of you who get Jason Richardson as your rep--treasure him!)

I do understand about the supply shortages with ABC because that had been happening months ago, too. Thye tried to explain about supply chains and ordering cycles; I just wanted the drugs to be there when I needed them!! I think sometimes there is aperson sitting at computer in some remote corner of the country making random selections about supply status without knowing for sure if an item is mfg out, temp out, etc.

This is somewhat subjective, as well. I'm sure some of us have different expectations of our wholesaler than others, not to mention, different levels of tolerance. I'm not one of the tolerant ones!!

Name of Facility: PORTER

Years as a Buyer: 9+

It is quite interesting to read the individual experiences that buyers have had with their primary wholesalers. It seems like if you have a great rep, that wholesaler gets high marks. From my perspective, in doing our conference for buyers, Cardinal Health and McKesson have been stronger supporters than AmerisourceBergen. This is also based on our experiences with the representatives who call on us regarding the conferences. When people change positions, it can be one buyer's loss and the wholesaler might suffer if an excellent replacement person is not found to carry on. I am confident that when we find that excellent representative at AmerisourceBergen, we will have many more positive comments to say about this wholesaler.

This message contains my personal opinions, and the opinions expressed are not those of Summerdale Enterprises, Inc.

Name of Facility: Editor-In-Chief, Pharmacy Purchasing Outlook

City, State: Newsletter

I've the opportunity (or misfortune, depends on how you look at it) to have dealings with all three major wholesalers when I was on the hospital side. Cardinal was, at least for me, the most Buyer-friendly company I dealt with. They would conduct regional Buyer meetings a few times a year, and we actually got a full tour of the plant, with an open invitation to come back when the plant was in full swing, in the middle of the night, when all the order filling is done.

They were the only company I knew of that hired buyers right out of the hospital to be sales reps and Pyxis technicians, even made one buyer a Sales Manager. The other wholesalers may do similar things, but I have first-hand experience with how Cardinal deals with Buyers.

Dealing with them on a Buyer level, I felt as though I had a personal Cardinal rep, who helped with inventory, and would even pick up emergency DEA orders so they would be delivered next day.

I liked Amerisource before they became AmerisourceBergen; afterwards my dealings with them was like dealing with the Keystone Kops. This was many years ago, so I don't know the current status of their level of service.

McKesson was on the tail end of my dealings with wholesalers, and to be honest, I didn't have enough time with them to make a positive or negative opinion of them.

Hope this helps

Name of Facility: Summerdale Enterprises, Inc.

City, State: Publishing

Years as a Buyer: 30+

PLEASE DON'T PUBLISH!

We are currently with Cardinal... I recently spoke with someone looking to change from AmerisourceBergen to Cardinal and I encouraged her not to switch.

Although Cardinal is all I've known, I have been fairly unhappy with some of their customer service, my rep is nice, but she doesn't have any initiative compared to some reps I've met at our PPO conference and other places. We are also signed up with their 340B split billing software company which I have been unhappy with as well. I only use Cardinal Choice for inventory, Cardinal.com is odd, but I have no system to compare it to. I do like the entelligence feature, but it costs you extra to have it.

One of my complaints is that we aren't allowed Saturday deliveries.. EVEN THOUGH... we receive a regular Saturday Cardinal Pyxis Assist delivery and they are able to delivery if I place an emergency order. If a driver is already here every Saturday to bring the Assist order, why can't I have a Saturday order each week?

Also, Cardinal contracts out their courier service and that has been an absolute nightmare for me... to the point where the VP of the courier service called me because I was having to file so many complaints about our courier.

I have problems with returns also, they sent me a fridge med in a room temp tote and refused to credit me for wanting to return it. It said on the box in red letters "Must be stored in refrigerator" and they refused to return it. I had to involve the company and it was a huge mess... in the process of that, customer service told me that the distribution center told them that I was wrong and they kept all of that drug on the shelves in the warehouse, not in the fridge... It took me forever to straighten that out.

Unless you've got major issues with Amerisource, I'd consider sticking with them

Years as a Buyer: 1+

Dont' publish, please!
A couple of things:
I agree wtih an earlier comment that Amerisource was way better than AmerisourceBERGEN!! I'm not sure they have ever got the edge they had before that merger. Again, there are things about ABC that are very good, but after 7+ months of using Cardinal, I've adjusted to the differences. I think Cardinal is making a huge effort getting their customer service levels ramped up.

A great rep can make all the difference, too. I am losing mine and am devastated; he is fabulous!! I live in hope that his replacement is half as good!!
I'm betting that you can get a Saturday delivery every week; I have always had one, but I think you give up some points in your pricing. That's a question I would pose to the rep.

And I agree about the contracted courier service. Our is OK, but not wonderful. Many years ago, we were with Cardinal when they had their own drivers--BIG difference! They had a stake in the company's reputation and were way more committed to giving good service.

Sometimes, I think this wholesaler is just a "crap shoot"! Each person's experience is so subjective, but better the devil you know, than the one you don't. So Colleen is probably on the right track in saying that unless you have major issues with whoever your wholesaler is, at least you know what you're dealing with on a daily basis! They all have problems and we all have learned how to cope with them!

Name of Facility: PORTER

Years as a Buyer: 9+

They took away our Saturday delivery when they signed the new 5 year contract right before I came here and were told that they no longer do any Saturday deliveries except for the ones that are still under the old contract.

Check on that though, I think its insane, esp. when a courier is already here every Saturday morning. It's just a way for them to make money though... charge $139 just to put it on a truck thats coming here anyway...

Years as a Buyer: 1+

We re-signed with The Cardinal last February and were
able to keep our 11 deliveries per week. We do not
utilize Cardinal Assist. I know that other hospitals in our system only get 5 deliveries per week.
It is really nice to still be able to have this luxury
and can be really helpful to your sister/neighbor
hospitals when they have a problem

Name of Facility: adventist hinsdale hospital.

City, State: 300 bed hospital

Years as a Buyer: 7

Boy, this is the best discussion thread we've ever had that we can't publish!

It was enlightening and a lot of fun reading everyone's comments.

Name of Facility: Summerdale Enterprises, Inc.

City, State: Publishing

Years as a Buyer: 30+

After I re-read my post, I want to clarify something, because like most companies, I'm sure Cardinal has someone lurking on here....................

My rep's lack of initiative on things is frustrating, but it sounded really bad the way I wrote it. I get frustrated when I request them to look into stocking an item, and I get told that my usage isn't enough to justify it, but then they never ask anyone else if they'd buy it too. I'm sure I'm not the only person that uses that particular DC that wants that item. If I am, fine, but atleast ASK!!! That drives me nuts, but that requires more effort on the reps part than they're willing to put forth.

I met a few buyers at the conference whose reps are awesome, but this is definitely an area I wish my rep would improve on. Maybe its with all wholesalers.... who knows?!

Years as a Buyer: 1+

That sounds like it should be on my 'don't' list. You may want to hand this to your rep:
http://techline.tripod.com/pharmacypurchasingoutlook/loserep.htm
It's an article on how a sales rep can shoot themself in the foot for doing stuff like you described. If you can't access it here, it's on the PPO Reprint page on the website. It's called "How to Lose a Rep in Ten Ways." At one time, this was given to all new Cardinal reps.

Name of Facility: Summerdale Enterprises, Inc.

City, State: Publishing

Years as a Buyer: 30+

I know what you mean and I've had the same thought. "Surely I can't be the ONLY facility that has usage on this item!" And when you know that it's a contract item, be it Novation, PACT, etc., many others will take advantage.

In the computer age we live in, it seems reasonable that Cardinal or ABC could send an email to all their accounts stating which drug had been requested and ask for usage from other facilities. That's an email I'd take time to respond to!!

Everyone, have a great week. Here in NW Indiana, we had 8-10" of snow over the weekend! Digging out the car was invigorating



And, thanks Mike for the levothyroxine update.

Ruth

Name of Facility: PORTER

Years as a Buyer: 9+

Hello All,

I know I am behind in posting my comments but better late than never.

Mike you are so right in saying this is the best discussion and we can't publish it.

Mooler-Thank you for starting this thread.

For what its worth, here is my two cents...

We have one delivery a day. I have tried negotiating for 2 deliveries only to be gently turned down.

My facility has been a Cardinal customer for the longest time so I have no experience with the other companies. I hated Choice and love the internet based software that allows me to function productively. There is a lot to learn and it sometimes frustrates the users. When Cardinal moved their customer service to a central location it created a lot of issues but they are finally ironing those out since the feedback from customers is really making a difference. But I must say that the team that handled my questions from the DC was a lot knowledgeable and I learnt a lot of things from them too.

Each rep brings unique abilities to the table. My former Cardinal rep moved first to a management position, then to another division and now to another company. I felt cheated and devastated that I was about to loose such a valuable person who taught me so much.

Reps solve the problems after we present them with the problems! We are the first people who see these problems and pass the baton to the reps. We the buyers are more resourceful since we have picked up tips and tricks along the way. This skill comes to us since we are the ones who deal with ALL kinds of reps! We- the buyers are the survivors of the trade. The reps mere tools who are channels to the wholesalers core.

The reps from the wholesale company have a lot to endure these days. This is a management decision as I see it. They have more accounts and more duties to do. I am merely making a point and am not biased at all. We don’t get individual attention from each one since each one is so busy, yet with three giants in the industry we have to choose which one to go with. Like Colleen says unless you have major problems stick it out with who you have. But it would be beneficial to all of us to know what each company has to offer besides just customer service and reps!

Name of Facility: Kern Medical Center--222 beds

City, State: Teaching, Acute care, Trauma II

Years as a Buyer: 6

Sorry for the late posting.

Our facility was with AmerisourceBergen for 20+ years before we switched almost two years ago to Cardinal.

I have to say I am very pleased we switched. Although I only dealt with ABC for about a year before we switched, I really never liked the company as a whole. Loved our reps, which ironically both have since left ABC and are drug reps with companies that we deal with and call on us again, and tech support, but our dealings with customer service and their service levels were the pits. Plus the technology offerings were basically non-existant.

My dealings with Cardinal go back 10 years as they were the secondary wholesaler for the retail pharmacy I worked for. Never had a problem with Cardinal in the five years I worked retail.

Cardinal has been great. Calls to customer service are routed to national call centers (luckily ours is 80 miles away from us), but you are assigned to a dedicated team (or at least we are). I can call or email and it's going to be one of five people to answer me, instead of the new person every time I called ABC. Questions are answered promptly, and they are willing to get items from another distribution center if ours is out, which is another thing ABC never did for us.

We utilize a lot of the technology offerings of Cardinal (CardinalAssist, ReadyScan, AccountSource Rx, Talyst Carousel) and besides the Carousel (whole other topic)we have streamlined our procurement process tremendously.

Only cons I can come up with about Cardinal are contract prices seem to be loaded slowly, resulting in a lot of credits and rebills (more annoying than anything), we are services out of a small distribution center, which posed issues at first with them stocking our GPO contracted items and in the quantities we need, and we are working on getting our third rep in two years (we are losing Gary Simons and getting Jason Richardson). Gary and Sonya (our first rep) have been great, and I'm sure Jason will be too [especially after reading Ruth's posts]. A little consistancy with the reps would be nice.

Name of Facility: UK HealthCare Chandler Medical Center

City, State: Teaching, Level 1 trauma, 473 beds

Years as a Buyer: 3